more damn cheaters using multiple avatars or alternatively one avatar with multiple users...

Many games i play on steam allow to make 2 to 4 avatars. APB:R and Planetside 2 maybe blacklight retributution and can get more slots by buying them.

I don't see a problem with making a 2nd avatar in EU aslong as you follow the rules and that you put money in to skill up so MA are still making money.
I would like in EU a male and a female avatar.

The way it was setup before with the new arivals area you could get 1.20 ped per avatar created and it was open to abuse
untill they changed and revamped the area.

In my lifetime ive made over 1,000 emails.

 

Hi,

IMHO this is a major bullshit.
Girtsn hit it perfectly, there. So I replied:

Any ways of trying this will inevitably fail, will only slightly hinder potential evildoers, but will will have a high probability to seriously harm honorable participants.

A rule that cannot be enforced isn't a rule, it's a joke. And a sign of lacking professionalism.

Instead of trying to set up, enforce and sanction such useless rules the development time would be better spent to fight the repercussions of the fact that both multi-avatars as well as multi-players exist, have ever existed and will ever exist. Don't battle the windmill vanes if you don't like their movement, block the windmills axle!

This discussion here should better be:
"What are the harms caused by multi-avatar or multi-player actions, and what can be done to reduce it?", IMHO.

For me, the most prominent harm would be the market manipulation. Let's have a look at RL (tm) regarding this:
We have (more or less) strong public authorities prosecuting this, we have laws, attorneys, judges, jails. But there's still market manipulation. But ways less than we'd have wouldn't we have these measures.

So what could be done? We could forbid Soc members bidding to another Soc members auction. We could pose a limit of how often an avatar may bid to another avatars auction. We might restrict the value a bid can be raised.
We could create quite some well defined little steps that would make it harder - not more. We could never completely stop it, but maybe we'd be able to limit it in a way that is tolerable. Just like in RL (tm).


And, by the love of Lootius, will you ppl never learn it? IPs and MACs are not a way to accomplish anything!

No problem at all for any evildoer to log in with different IP's/ MACs from a single computer. No problem at all to change them at will. For people that want to grab a little more PED using different IPs it's no problem to do the tiny investment into multiple ISPs, Proxies, VPNs etc. Or to change the MAC for every login, and for every VirtualMachine. No way to stop them.

But you'll hurt anybody that is playing behind a router: families, participants playing from IN-cafes, dormitories, hotels, public WLANs, hospitals or similar, participants playing from countries where they MUST use VPN/ Proxie to circumvent the governments censorship, a lot of perfectly legit participants!
And the people that have an ISP that gives out new IPs with every router reboot, and even during the "enforced disconnection once a day". And this is close to all Western Europe.
And the people that are playing from different places - well, isn't there an announcement that we'll be able to log in from our SmartFones already? Oh, your iFone hasn't the same IP as your machine at home? No, you're not allowed to create an auction, you must be a dreaded misfit!

Relying on IPs and/ or MACs for "fraud protection" doesn't stop one determined evildoer, but heavily harms a serious number of perfectly legit players. Learn it plz, finally! This is the internez of 2012!

Have fun!

 

In EU you dont need a new ip or mac i even had a static ip one that never changes.

Could make a a few thousand of accounts from the machine

The only flag that might pop up is if one plays with 2 computers on the same net/info

 

Hi,

Yep, and this is what would hit me, for instance - my wife and I play from behind the same NAT router - so same IP, maybe even same MUC.

(You might have replied to a post-in-the-making. It might have not been ready at the time of replying. Took some time, tried something new ...)

Besides, all this talk of IP and such in the linked thread makes me grin & cry at the same time. Obviously these ppl have no plan at all, nor any deeper knowledge of the network.
IPv6 is at the doors, and not without any thoughts there's quite some mechanics in place to hide the unique identification of the end user. Would be a wet dream for any dictator to have such - one wrong post anywhere, compete IP ban, never get heard again, even IN block maybe? Digital gag ...

Such shall not happen. And because it's most desirable that people cannot be reduced to a sheer IP number that can be blocked easily any means to use this in a game is doomed. For what reason ever.

We cannot set up communication possibilities for human rights organizations, for suppressed humans living in dictatorships, and at the same time trying to use the mechanics we actively fight for control. We'd work against ourselves.

So any try to control the fact of 1 person having more accounts, or more persons playing 1 avatar is in vain, doomed, lost time. There is no way to do it. Not but going this deep into the participants privacy that nobody in a clear state of mind would touch this ever, anymore.

It's hard enough already. Would I ever think of withdrawing, I cannot use my bank accounts. I'm self employed and tax office would roast me slowly, on low fire. Gaming income? OMG - they'd cancel any write-off from my server park, my ISP costs, my IT related expenses. Because they'd assume I'd not only use my 1 private machine, wouldn't it be much more obvious to use the phat graphics workstation, or the powerful servers? They don't know, sure, but they'd assume. And it would be me to go to court, with an insanely high risk to burn insane money, and then loose anyways, because the judge might be an digital analphabetic as well.

Already in the very moment I cannot be sure that a withdrawal would ever work. I have my wifes bank account accredited. But, for sure, no way to prove that it's mine. Maybe I should really try once - I never ever withdrew yet.

This is hot iron. No way to really stop potential evildoers, but a high potential to hurt honest EU participants. And a community that happily jumps any witch-hunt-train, without further intelligence. No fun, I think.

Rules that cannot be enforced should be dropped, instead there should be worked on to stop the negative consequences. This at least might have a chance to work.

Have fun, nevertheless!

 

Hi,

Kidding? I shall be punished as soon as I want to play together with my wife? And what about the children? They can't log in when on visit, to receive their virtual XMas gift? We all need to live divided, in different places and with different ISP's, due to some IMHO ridiculous player paranoia, right? Kidding?

MA could make this game quite secure, requiring all & any personal data, hard-copies of official documents, a fingerprint at any log in, whatever. And still go down the drain with it.
Because it's ways more than many ppl are ready to share. It's still a video game, not more.

And putting up security measures like in a high-security weapon factory will not help to the popularity of the game.


MA should completely abandon these restrictions after creating working measures against the abuse by them, IMHO.
They cannot prohibit them, any measures taken will only slightly anger the evildoers, but seriously hurt perfectly legit participants. More harm done but benefit.

You (that doesn't mean you alone, MasterMesh) are asking for measures that easily might be able to shut down EU. It already has crazy security measures - I don't know any other game that might ask me for a copy of my drivers license or any other official doc. This alone will repel a lot of people. And will not help much once EU will be accused of money laundering, or of providing a game of chance, what are ways more important accusations but "market manipulation in a video game".

To determine what to fight first, and with what measures, is crucial.

A few restrictions on auctioning, as I mentioned above, would maybe severely hurt the dreaded resellers and market manipulators. Feel free to add suggestions!

Any other fight against using more-then 1 avatar, or more players playing 1 avatar are doomed, because there's no way to prove it. Drop it! Find a way to prohibit potential benefits of doing so instead!

Is it this hard to understand?

Cya!

 

My other ava is Marco.. anyone want pvp? Me with my gun.. http://www.entropedia.info/Info.aspx?chart=Weapon&name=Unique_Official_MindArk_PHG_-_v.Marco

 

I am one of then guys, if you are not allowed but can, don't. I have invested a bit of money in this game for something as little as a double Ava for MA to have an excuse if I withdraw.

My 2c

Sorry about the neco I wanted to get a bit more action happening

 

I am impressed with both sides of this argument, however I think if MA removed safe guards of multi avatars playing by one individual (dubious by nature ones),there would be rampant mayhem and scams constantly attacking any "legitimate" new players and would ruin game completely in my opinion. This thread and information in it is very "eye opening," and hats off to Entropia Planets! This little diddy was very informative: http://www.entropiaplanets.com/wiki/Jason_Peterson

 

Are you the Rose who used to hang out with my soc mate DD?

 

DD :D