Overlooked it in my rush to banter. Anyways I still have some steam to to write out. It depresses and infuriates me a lot to see people stick to American economics like they're an absolute model for economics. They think a free market is whatever they want it to be. That is to say: money to me, screw others. Picture this: we were nicely making arrangements to drive sweat prices up (half joking, but still) when an idiot of sorts started blabbing about how fixing prices is banned and whatnot and that's why we couldn't agree on a min. price for sweat. FUCK THAT, I SAY! Hangar owners did establish a standard fare and they were not banned. No, their current predicament is not a result of their "daring", just a standard MA screwup. Crafters and miners and everyone does it. Granted, some popular commodities just fluctuate depending on market demand, stock and stuff, because, hell, why not? But sweat could well be a commodity that could change according to a consortium of sweaters. Yes, it involves a cyclopean community effort but how the hell am I supposed to achieve anything with fear mongers and scant übers insisting on thwarting my efforts? When I say: "Let's agree on 5PEDs/k" there someone saying "That will never work, lol. Buying 2PEDs/k". Well why the hell don't you shut your big fat mouth and see what happens? That's not a planned economy either, it's the invisible hand peeking out. WE, as parts of the market, have the power to drive the market as we please. WE are the market. WE are the invisible hand. A hard concept for the uneducated to grasp but, believe me, in a planned economy, there would be no place for your holierthanthou snicker. You'd be in the same boat or in a governing body. People dismiss the sweat issue as something that cannot be fixed or that leeches do to get their money. Well, you insist this isn't a game yet you can't cope with serious economics when they interfere with your play, how does that work? Quite frankly, I couldn't care less about sweating. I do it to get me some virtual pocket money but it is quite a nuisance to meet people that believe I'm inferior to them because of my "chosen" in-game profession. Somehow, I know less than they do because I'm a sweater. Somehow, I'm less of a person because I don't deposit. Somehow, I take their loots away because I ask for a fair price. It's puberty angst all over again! And that's it. I'm done bantering.
What I don't understand is how ME is the same price it was when sweat was 5 ped/k and force nexus had a little markup... :/ Weird stuff.
My hypothesis is that sweat has been driven down by greed, not so much availability. It is a resource meant for inexperienced players to obtain and sell. They fall for whatever price they can get so buyers always drive the price a few PECs down just to see if they can. The answer is yes, yes they can, they always could and they will always continue to do so.
First, the notion of free market presented by Bizarric seems of course absolutely wrong. The United States today is far from a free market. The original US kept taxes under 5% and the government kept out of contorlling businesses, today taxes are over 50%? (if not higher) and its government regulates everything and bails out bankrupt banks! Todays US system is more akin to keynes and Mussolini (pro regulation and state control) than Adam Smith and Jackson (his last words when asked what he would be most proud of achieving were: "I killed the bank") so indeed nothing americans shoud be proud of, however also far far far away from what the US was designed to be, and what is bringing it down. The explanation to this is extensive and annoying so i wont get into details, however the US is not a free market today. To stick to the topic, I believe I understand Bizarric'ss complaint, I saw recently a guy standing at twin peaks market asking the new players not to sell for less than 3, perhaps this is a start of a change? On a free market people can bargain with what they have, we got used of accepting what others who got there first are willing to give us. I understand the rant, and yes, the new players shoud demand a little more, however I really would like to see a free market going on and if new players are greedy to sell for anything just so they can go shooting something I guess they deserve it, then. I say this by experience althought I never sold my sweat for less than 5ped, I have been however blessed with good willing übers in my humble begginings. The problem that this happens is that on this game players cannot kill animals with their bare hands and need guns and weapons, this is where the problem lays as I see it.
Yup, the definition presented is wrong because the perceived notion is absolutely wrong. People label this a "free market" but they're wrong because it only marginally resembles a free market. I'd call it a wild market, more like. It is savage and darwinian. There are many kinds of markets and a free market can have many tints and shades of gray. People take the words "freedom" and "democracy" as justifications to blind themselves to these issues. The American dream has always been an illusion and people just refuse to build their OWN dream. They believe our systems are perfect the way they are because they have deluded themselves into complacency. Sounds like RL? Well, hell, EU could have been a nice haven from the crap we take IRL but, no, they had to screw it worse than RL itself. You ARE quite fortunate if you have been able to sell for 5 PEDs all these years. And that's one of my main arguments. If a few people can pay a fair price, everyone can. Low end players and new comers need a way to be integrated into the game. I have previously suggested to either revamp or kill sweating to introduce a better system that will allow players to integrate. As the system stands, it's only a matter of a few major VUs before markup and TT values are too close.
Just out of curiousity, what makes you think 5 ped per k is a fair price? Mind Essence seems to sell for 130% so even if you got the force nexus for tt, and the mind essence magically created itself without the use of a refinder then the buyer would still lose 2 ped per k purchased.
It's higher than 2.5 PEDs, that's for sure. As to what IS fair... well, that's another debate... As I said, sweat should either be revamped or killed so a better system could take place.
I have to agree with Bizarric in the sense that at least the term "sweat" is sort of degrading, when you already start on rags and without any possible way to defend yourself so you have to "sweat". When I started on this game I took it as "pun intended". It is odd how computer nerds (or geeks) have this misconception that a new player must be humiliated in any possible way, fe-fi-fo-fum I smell weak egos in display. To the designers of this game I must remind them that we are playing to have fun, not to "sweat", degrade ourselves or any derrogatory feeling as the frustration for not being even able to punch animals in return. I would exchange "sweating" for punching the animals for something as low in value as "sweat" anytime.
speaking as a non depositing sweater myself.....i would lik tu see the price of sweat rise up....if only a little bit
